Announcer: 0:00

The following programming is sponsored by Marc J. Bernstein. The views expressed do not necessarily reflect the views of this station, its management, or Beastly Media Group. Entrepreneur, founder, author, and financial advisor Marc Bernstein helps high-performing business owners turn their visions into reality through its innovative work and the forward-focused form. Marc connects entrepreneurs to resources that fuel their success. Founders Forum is a radio show and podcast where entrepreneurs share their journeys, revealing the lessons they've learned and the stories behind their success. Join Marc and his guests for a mix of inspiration, valuable insights, and a little fun. Now, let's dive in.

Marc Bernstein: 0:40

Good morning, America. How are you? It's a um we're in Philadelphia today recording. Sometimes we're in Florida, sometimes we're remote. Uh it's today is proof that it's not always sunny in Philadelphia. It's kind of a cloudy day, but it's um pleasant day, pleasant fall day. I love this time of the year. Beautiful season changes, the leaves are beautiful. Our guest here is Kevin this morning. Good morning, Kevin.

Kevin Hyde: 1:06

Hey, good morning. Good to be with you.

Marc Bernstein: 1:08

I'll introduce them in a minute. And um our topic of the day was suggested by Kevin, and I love it, and I'll explain why I love it after we talk about it, but it's about being of service, which I know is important to you in your life. Tell me why that is and how you feel about it and how you exercise that.

Kevin Hyde: 1:24

Uh well, I guess part of it is my I grew up with parents that were very much, you know, how can we serve the community? So it was always sort of out there anyway. Right. And then I went into the military, which is obviously quite service-driven. And since then I've, you know, been a very important thing to do.

Marc Bernstein: 1:40

Thank you for your service.

Kevin Hyde: 1:41

Oh, I appreciate that. Thank you. And, you know, ever since then, it's just I find ways in the community. If they ask, I do it, right? You know, if I sit on the zoning board, I help out with the parks and my church. I do like if there's a thing we can do and I get my kids to help with it too. I think it's just a good backbone being part of the community.

Marc Bernstein: 1:59

Well, you're a great example. The reason it was on my mind, and it was such a good topic for you to pick, is yesterday I was at the Satel Institute um CEO conference, semi-annual CEO conference. I've spoken about this on the show. It's it is representative for corporate social responsibility, so it meets businesses with nonprofits. So that's all we talked about all morning yesterday was how to best be of service. And interestingly, you and I talked about this offline yesterday featured featured the Philadelphia Eagles, who are really known for their work. They do a lot of different things, but they're most known for their work in regard to autism. And the woman who runs the Foundation for Autism was spoken and she was brilliant. And another thing we were talking about that we'll talk about is culture. And we were talking about Don Smolensky, who's the president of the Eagles operation, talked about, and you've had experience. Maybe you talk about your experience with that with the Eagles for a second, if you want.

Kevin Hyde: 2:56

Yeah, well, I d I was fortunate to go to a uh a corporate hosted event where I got to meet Don and you know the whole executive team at the Eagles. And being a transplant to Philadelphia, I adopted the city. I adopted the Eagles. I bleed green because I want to, you know. Right, right. So getting to hear from the leadership how top down their executive uh culture is and how much they try to push that into the locker room, onto the field was honestly inspiring and fun to hear. And that happened to be the year we went to the Super Bowl in 20, the 2017 season. Then I went to another corporate event in the 2022 season and again last year. So I think every time I go to a corporate event at the Eagles Stadium, we go to a Super Bowl.

Marc Bernstein: 3:34

So I'll just leave that out there as a general invite. There you go. So we'll so by the way, so so that brings me to my point too, that being of service can happen. They talked about not just similar to you, not just when you're out there doing service work, but being of service every day in your company, to other employees, to to your mission, to whatever that is. And that they're throughout the the organization. And everybody that was talked ended with what I would say to you, go birds, you know. Of course. Which I actually saw a funny video this morning. That's another word for thank you for holding the door or thank you. You know, people do this, go birds. Go birds. No, he writes it. Yeah, 100%.

Kevin Hyde: 4:15

It's become it's become never a bad greeting or yeah.

Marc Bernstein: 4:18

Right. It's become uh uh what's the word? Uh um omnis um omnipresent um ubiquitous ubiqu ubiqu I always have a hard time saying this. Ubiquitous. Ubiquitous. Become ubiquitous. Yes. Go birds. Go birds. Anyway, so Kevin, thank you for being here today. Yeah. So Kevin is Kevin Hyde. He's president of Layer Eight Security. He's a cybersecurity expert with more than two decades of experience building cyber operations for both private industry and the U.S. government. During his 21 years of service in the Marine Corps, intelligence commit community, and U.S. Cyber Command, he helped create and deploy cyber maturity models and training programs for allied nations in the private sector, which is pretty heavy duty stuff. In the private sector, he's led business growth across technology, consulting, and e-commerce, bringing a rare blend of national security and business expertise to the cybersecurity world. That's a lot. That's pretty clear.

Kevin Hyde: 5:19

If you told my 15-year-old self that would be my bio, I would not have believed you.

Marc Bernstein: 5:23

For sure. Pretty impressive, and and I can imagine that would be the case. Uh so let's talk about your entrepreneurial career. I know it started young, so why don't you tell us how that happened, how you got into the Marines and what happened after that.

Kevin Hyde: 5:40

So my my dad was a serial entrepreneur, you know, and like most entrepreneurs, there are ups and downs. But the the idea of work ethic and knowing how to work hard was always present, never didn't have that. Like, you want to earn money, you want to do a thing, have a thing, you better work for it. So I always had that since since the time I was probably 12. I had I had, you know, um jobs, I was sweeping out, you know, construction sites, I was mowing lawns, you know. We moved up north as when I was a teenager, I was shoveling driveways, um, you know, cleaning windows, you know, whatever I could do. Um and same thing in college. Any we didn't have gig economy jobs, but I was working in bakeries, I was selling vinyl windows and doors door to door. Like, I mean, I had jobs that definitely fell into the suck range, right? But um, it taught me a lot. And so I've always had that work hard spirit, but then I went into the Marine Corps, right? And that's a very different style of living because you're just dedicated to that craft of building marine culture, you know, furthering the mission, whatever that might be, wherever you are. I went into the Marines in '99. So when 9-11 happened, my life changed overnight. I was a public affairs officer at the time, and we went from being media relations, community relations to suddenly crisis response, crisis action. And uh that led to a whole nother life. The entrepreneurial side of my life, though, uh my dad calls me the accidental entrepreneur because I never thought I'd help start a business. That wasn't a goal of mine. Um, I happened to be paired up with a good uh friend who who was into that lifestyle, wanted to start a business, had the means to get it going, and he and I co-founded Layer Eight. So the the going straight from the ranks of the Cyber Command and the NSA and the Marines to to the private sector starting a company was a a very unique transition. Um was it a culture shock? It was a culture shock. I had very I felt like the um I was afraid to be too bold because in the in the um you know transition from being Marine, you know, as a staff officer, as a major in the Marines, you know, you're working for the lieutenant colonel who's working for the colonel, who's working for the generals, and so on. And I, you know, you you're trying to do everything right to make sure that they're happy with the outcome. And as an entrepreneur, it really just matters, are you happy with the outcome?

Marc Bernstein: 8:03

Yeah, by the way, I hadn't thought about that a lot, but being in military service is almost the opposite of being an entrepreneur.

Kevin Hyde: 8:10

A hundred percent. Right, right.

Marc Bernstein: 8:13

I hadn't hadn't really occurred to me that way, but that's good.

Kevin Hyde: 8:15

Yeah, there's no SOP for it. That's you know, like, you know, part of the job I did at Cyber Command, I was I was pulled in to do it because there was no SOP and I had to create it. And so that was a good aspect, you know, I found that I could do. But as an entrepreneur, you definitely don't have there's no here's what you do, here's what you're doing.

Marc Bernstein: 8:34

But even that, they gave you the job to create an SOP.

Kevin Hyde: 8:37

Yeah.

Marc Bernstein: 8:37

So you're you're there to do what you were told. Entrepreneurs are almost told you almost have to do what you're not told and figure it out. Yeah, kinda. You know, right? I mean it's it's there is no there is no there is no really one book. You know, there's all kinds of book about entrepreneurialism, but nobody really tells you follow this step by step. It's not gonna happen.

Kevin Hyde: 9:00

Yeah, you'll know if it's not working when it's not working. Right. That's how you know. Right. Because no one's buying what you're selling.

Marc Bernstein: 9:05

I talk a lot about on this show, Kevin, that um it's not it's not necessarily a smooth ride, you know, to be an entrepreneur, right? So so tell us about the beginnings of the business and what kind of challenges you faced, because every everybody does.

Kevin Hyde: 9:17

Aaron Powell You know, it's funny. Um when we first got going, I I I had spent you know, years with you know, in uniform, you know, trying to defend American interests from the Chinese and the Russians and the Iranians and whatnot in cyberspace. Going to the private sector, we thought we have this great set of services that we can provide. Let's do that, or we're gonna keep these companies safe. And honestly, in 2014-15 timeframe, that was a really hard sales job. Nobody really understood what they needed and didn't think it mattered to them or they weren't important enough, but that wasn't true. So we had to pivot to not just where they are, you know, okay, we had to sell them on, you need cybersecurity, then we had to sell them on and let us do it for you. So there's always two sales jobs. Um finally, though, we realized the trend really wasn't just about who wants to be better protected, because everybody does. It was really about um what kind of compliance requirements do you have? If you're a uh biotech, you've got FDA, if you're publicly traded, there's SEC. If you're you know in the healthcare sector, there's HIPAA, there's all these acronyms soup out there that that re create these requirements for people. So we figured out how to craft the services around those compliance requirements so that it was an easier construct for someone to buy into to understand, and then they'd get how we fit perfectly to help match it.

Marc Bernstein: 10:40

I think I told we talked about Sari Green, who is uh who was a guest on the show, who started one of the earliest cybersecurity companies by accident in I think early like 2002, something like that, in the early 2000s. Yeah. Yeah. And really there was a need with a company and they fulfilled the need and they just kind of walked into it. But um, I know that it was like the uh it was like the Wild West then, I think. You know what I mean?

Kevin Hyde: 11:06

I think so. And and honestly, I think it was very software. People probably called it computer security at the time. Like the term cybersecurity didn't exist when I was in college, so I certainly didn't get an education in it from a young age. Exactly. It's it would have to have been something that you sort of fell into. Yeah.

Marc Bernstein: 11:20

And you're feeling your way through it to a certain extent. Yeah.

Kevin Hyde: 11:23

Yeah.

Marc Bernstein: 11:24

Um so so so that was your challenge. It's kind of it's morphed into something other than what you originally figure out why people really wanted it.

Kevin Hyde: 11:32

What really made them want to get into okay, now I get why I need it and why you're the best team to help me with it.

Marc Bernstein: 11:38

What how do you what's the division of labor between you and your partner? How's that work?

Kevin Hyde: 11:43

So um basically is the president of the company and he's the CEO. Uh as the president, I I run the revenue team, which is you know, the branding, the sales, marketing, business operations side of the world. Um I bring in most of the clients, the client relationships, uh, just from you know, hustle in general, right? I mean Jeff does too. We everyone is focused on that, but it this is a thing that I end up being, you know, pretty um pretty focused on 90% of the time is bringing in new clients and making sure the current clients are are happy. So I I spend most of my time there.

Marc Bernstein: 12:16

What what kind of strengths did you did you and your partner develop? Excuse me. Um in in um what kind of strengths did you develop in terms of meeting those challenges of of the ever-changing landscape of cybersecurity?

Kevin Hyde: 12:34

So I would say this, you know, it was staying on top of trends was always key, right? Um cybersecurity, every day there's a new breach. You can't know everything about every breach. So what we try to know is pick the verticals. And so what we did was we said, all right, between healthcare, biotech, uh, financial services, mortgage companies, and now government contractors, they all have huge requirements to meet. So what do we need to do from a services standpoint? So Jeff is always very focused on are the services relevant? And then are we are we delivering them properly? Really, it's one of the biggest keys for us. And then I'm focused on how do we get those relevant services into the marketplace. And so sort of dividing and conquering, you know, if uh if you figure the roles responsibilities key, that's kind of how we how we divvy it up. And you know, we also try to make sure we're never overdoing it. Like he and I rarely need to be in the same room at the same time. Why not split, divide, and conquer? So we figured that out pretty early on.

Marc Bernstein: 13:32

They have complementary skills, which helps a lot. Very much. Yeah, very good. Um looking out, uh we don't we only have about a minute before break. So I want to ask you a little t talk to me a little bit about your company culture.

Kevin Hyde: 13:45

Well, we try to be very um enthusiastic about each other's wins. When somebody gets root on a system, we're doing a penetration test. We celebrate it with a win. You know, we make a sale happen, we ring the gong, we put out emails, we try to celebrate wins. Nice because we're we're a small organization, right? We're like 30 employees and always, you know, scrappy and growing, but we try to make sure we're celebrating wins. Um, we also train our people, and that's something a lot of people in our a lot of companies on our our field don't do because they're afraid if they train people and they get searched, they're gonna go somewhere else. Okay. But you know, there's that old attitude.

Marc Bernstein: 14:19

They don't want them to know too much.

Kevin Hyde: 14:20

Yeah, and they also don't want them to be too marketable or get but that's not how we operate. Right. You know, we want people at the top of their game and not not, you know, exercising a year old uh process. We want them having the latest, greatest all the time. So so that innovation is. Yeah, I think keep them at their best and keep them innovating and thinking fresh about how to solve problems and not just sticking with some old you know, stay on, day on, old process. We want them thinking fresher than that.

Marc Bernstein: 14:50

I'll bet your marine background helped with that because uh aren't the Marines all about always being your best kind of thing.

Kevin Hyde: 14:56

Aaron Powell 100%. You know, what do you did you do something today to make the life better for somebody around you? As a leader, I'd always think like that. Um I try to always think like that. By no means am I perfect. I but I it's a huge emphasis, is is what have you done to look around and make sure someone else is doing it well?

Marc Bernstein: 15:12

Amazing. Well, with that, it's a really good place to take a short break, and we'll be right back on Founders Forum.

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Marc Bernstein: 16:18

We're back on Founders Forum with my guest today, Kevin Hyde. Great to have you here, Kevin. So far I'm really enjoying the conversation. Uh, one of the things you and I talked about prior to the show was uh which is very important to you is work-life balance. You know, your wife travels for her job, and sometimes you're home alone with the kids, and you've got this business to run. Want to talk about expand on that a little bit?

Kevin Hyde: 16:41

Yeah, it's all about, you know, you can call it time management, but it's but balance is is key, and that's the one thing I try to always focus on. There, you know, my wife, she's I married up. She's a total superstar, and she does travel. So there are times when I've got to balance, you know, meetings, sales calls, etc. And I've got kids that need to go to schools, I've got activities, things like that. I gotta work with my village around me, my neighbors, friends, etc., to help help us out. And what am I doing to pay them back, help them out when they do? So how do I reciprocate? And I and I try never to just take a favor for granted, right? And so how am I doing to help out the rest of that village? So it really it comes down to I if that means I gotta log back on at 10 o'clock at night so I can cook dinner, make sure the kids are taking care of, the school's doing what they need, you know, it's important to be a parent to me. And and so I I just feel like it it's the way I do it is just work the time where I need to be and and don't feel bad that I'm not in the office nine to five. It's not about that. It's about getting the job done and the outcomes produced at the end of the day. So as long as I can work that out, you know, that might mean you're working nights or weekends, but that means I'm there as a parent, as a friend when it's needed.

Marc Bernstein: 17:53

And you didn't say this, but you implied it, and I can tell by the way you are. When you're with your kids, you're with your kids, and when you're working, you're working.

Kevin Hyde: 18:00

Try. Right. As much as possible. No, nobody's perfect when you're trying to do that. Oh, bad. You try, yeah. Right.

Marc Bernstein: 18:05

Yep. Kevin, let's talk about the future, which is one of the big things we do on the show. Uh if you were looking out three years from today, which would be the end of October 2028, and you and I are talking, and w when we were looking back on the last three years, what would have to happen in your life? And it could be business, it could be personal as well, where you would feel that that was a successful three-year period in your life?

Kevin Hyde: 18:32

You know, it's a it's an interesting question, and I I we'd we briefly talked about it, and when I had it in my head, I kept changing my answer. And and I felt like that was, you know, not quite a failure, but I was like, uh why isn't there not just some hundred percent crystal clear vision that's that's there three years from now? And I think that it there's a couple of reasons. Um part of the emphasis that I've always had is better. Just be better, you know, and don't let don't let perfection don't let progress be the enemy of uh perfection. I always try to make sure that I'm not trying to be a perfectionist, but I want to make progress happen.

Marc Bernstein: 19:08

So when you I think it's don't let perfection be the enemy of progress. I know I messed it up. Thanks for calling me on it. Of course you're gonna call me on it. No, no, be me honest. I know I say that because one of my sayings, I this three-year vision question comes from my work in the strategic coach with Dan Sullivan. And one of his other favorite expressions is progress, not perfection. He didn't create that, I don't believe, but he may put it out there a lot. And I, you know, so so of course that's all of us. You you want to you want to progress.

Kevin Hyde: 19:39

Yeah.

Marc Bernstein: 19:39

Um, but you can also still have along the lines kind of checkpoints where you want to be in a certain period of time.

Kevin Hyde: 19:45

And I think to to get down to some of the tactics of what that would look like three years from now, part of what professionally I would like to see what the good that we're doing, just how much of a bigger stage can we do it on. You know, if if we're getting the message out and we're helping these companies stay in business. I think I just want to see what can we do to make that happen at a grander scale. You know, how do we grow the amount of companies we can touch and help um to stay in business.

Marc Bernstein: 20:12

Scaling the business in a in a in a um in a good way where you're where you're keeping your service consistent, the level of service consistent, but scaling it to a bigger audience.

Kevin Hyde: 20:23

Not diluting the quality of what we deliver is key for sure. 100%. Yeah and that's and that's something that we always focus a lot on is I don't ever want a client to think well we haven't heard from you in forever and you're not delivering quality but suddenly it's renewable time. So you know now we're getting your attention. Never wanted that to happen. So that's not the way I work it's not the way Jeff works. So we've always focused on that. So that quality can't and that's been a a struggle is how do you scale that? So for sure that's been a a a you know a challenge.

Marc Bernstein: 20:51

So that's the challenge how do you scale it?

Kevin Hyde: 20:53

Yeah.

Marc Bernstein: 20:54

What strengths do you think you and Jeff and your company have developed that will help you meet that challenge I think I think learning to be um adaptable to the market conditions.

Kevin Hyde: 21:06

I mean you know the I can tell you we felt really strong about where we were going as a company with new directions, new services, some new staff members in January of 2020. Well three months later you know the whole world changed and then we had to adapt quickly and we did and we grew through that key word was pivot then, right? Yeah and it's it was pivoting it was taking a different perspective it was also you know don't fight you got to fight the fight you can fight right now, right? I mean, you know, and also uh George Washington ism I'm a you know study of George Washington you know don't make a decision until there's a decision to be made. So you know you can put things in place and start to to put some chess pieces out there but you don't need to execute until it's time to execute but also knowing when to execute is key.

Marc Bernstein: 21:51

So that's been a a key thing I think we've learned so think how lucky you were to have the pandemic from that perspective.

Kevin Hyde: 21:58

Yeah. Because we've all learned I I completely changed a lot of the ways I do business the way I develop business the way we everything because we had to right and I learned how to quicken sales cycles using video and and video content whether it was recorded or just a uh you know Zoom or whatever. So like there are ways we learn how to how do we get content marketing to work for us and push us up to the top of the pile when people are searching for us. That was one of the things I learned to like how do we make that better? How do we quicken that?

Marc Bernstein: 22:29

You you and I share that because that's exactly the kind of changes I made as well in our business and um and what what I find now is I think you'd be the same it was scary to pivot at that time because you're doing completely new things. It's not scary anymore. I have to pivot now it's like I can do it on a dime almost 100%.

Kevin Hyde: 22:49

And not being fearful that was one of the things too like just get out there. Go do it. If it's if it fails, you know, that old Silicon Valley it failed fast. Right. You know whatever, but that's a relative term, right? I know for some people it's a month, some people it's a year. But if it's not failure it's learning, right? Yeah if it's working have some milestones that lets you know it's going in the right direction. Yeah. Yeah that's a bit and big key.

Marc Bernstein: 23:10

So so what with that in mind, how do you does it does it is it do you have it in mind how you'll scale the business yet or have you thought that through or is that so I think that you know we've uh the people make a big difference.

Kevin Hyde: 23:26

Having the right people um make all the difference. And so you know I think there's a lot of adaptation to you know if five years ago the adaptation was to selling in a COVID environment in a pandemic environment now the adaptation is selling in an AI environment. How do we sell using AI? How do we deliver using AI? And do we right just because you can as we should so you know does it dilute quality does it so we need to focus on where those aspects are I think to make a for make our clients and our future clients certain that we're not sacrificing quality level for what they need for a sound bite that we delivered with AI.

Marc Bernstein: 24:05

Anything else you would add to your three year vision? Anything on the personal side anything that to round that out?

Kevin Hyde: 24:11

If my kids are still coming to me in three years as knowing that I'm a champion for them and that I'm they can come to me with anything I think that's a win you know how old will they be in three years? My daughter's 14 my son is almost 14. So she'll be in college and he'll he'll be you know applying that's the right question. Yeah yeah so if they're still coming to me and saying dad what do you think then that's a win. Yeah you know I mean I I want to be relevant but not overly burdensome. I need them to learn and struggle on their own and I think I've enabled my wife and I have enabled that I just want to make sure that you know I'm I'm able to to to be a person in their life they can come to as an anchor and tell me a problem and you know dad just listen or dad I want some advice and I'll I'll I'll be there and I and I think that's the biggest key for me. I love that um I know you're a reader I'm gonna switch we only have a couple minutes left what uh what are you reading currently so I actually brought it here um it's an older book it's called Golf is not a game of perfect and um by uh is that Bob Bob Rotello Bob Rotello So it's not even just about golf but I can tell you a quick story. Uh a few months ago um the last year or two I started playing more golf and I'm I'm good not great. Anybody tell you I'm fun on a golf course but I'm not uh I'm an average player. Another thing we have in common well yeah I mean you know I think that's probably describes a lot of people but but I've I have some potential but I I realized you know one day I was playing and I was w paired up with a guy I didn't know and I started sharing some personal stuff with him because it was just stuff that was on my mind. And suddenly my swing got better and suddenly I started playing better and my head was clear because he and I just sort of naturally matched up and started talking. So then I I asked him about anything he's read lately about you know improving his golf game. He's had this he's got his own dusty version of this book because this book is from the 90s and he said this was the thing that got his mental game right which meant you know it he didn't worry about his swing. He didn't you know course management and all that stuff. Those things matter but they're not the most important part. And he said if you read this book think about it as you know some days you don't have the driver some days you're not going to swing it well. So stop it. You know and he goes every time you read the word golf just say life. Life is not a game of perfect right same thing to our other line. So he he and this is sort of that old guy wisdom which I love because he was probably 25 years older than me and was still swinging it great and didn't care if you hit a bad shot. It did not register you know in his mind he just okay make sure the next one's where you want it to be and focus on the thing that you can do at that exact moment and not what happened before and not what's about to happen. Being in the moment has always been a challenge for me. And so this was sort of a a couple of parables all coming together to help me think through it. So this is literally the book I'm reading at this exact moment. I'm about halfway through it's great. So when this show came up and this was the book, this is the book.

Marc Bernstein: 27:06

Check out Fred Shoemaker too he has a book similar to that and tells his story as a young player where he he quit playing because it was so much pressure and he couldn't stand it and he ends up getting challenged by a guy he does some service work in South Africa and this guy finds out he's golfer and a guy challenges him to play golf and the guy in his book did everything wrong but ended up beating him and it was sort of the lessons he learned from that and he had a new approach to golf which had so much to do with his mindset. And um a guy that turned me on to his his work who was a friend teacher took a couple lessons from him he's he had me read the book which I did and I the name is escaping me right now. But he um one day I was seeing him and I had a match to play and I said do you have any advice for him and I'm thinking he'll tell me something about my swing or something like that and he thinks about it for a minute and he says enjoy the walk you know right and that's a great way to end our show today. Everybody listening enjoyed the walk enjoy the journey be in the moment and uh Kevin thanks so much for being here it's been great thank you all for listening and we'll see you next week on Founders Forum